Debate timelineDec 16, 2024

Allah IS NOT God... Change My Mind! | Live Debates

Moves

Topics

Unique refs

Claims

Topic annotation timeline

1Torah and Gospel Corruption1 move 2Gospel Reliability1 move 3Jesus' Mission and Atonement1 move 4Jesus' Divinity and Sonship2 moves 5Monotheism and worship1 move 6Trinity in the Old Testament1 move 7Biblical canon / textual authority2 moves 8Encouragement / patience1 move 9Prophets and language of revelation1 move 10Jesus' Crucifixion1 move 11Islamic Theology4 moves 12Divine names / fatherhood2 moves 13Rest in Christ1 move 14Original sin / Eden narrative1 move

Torah and Gospel Corruption1 move Gospel Reliability1 move Jesus' Mission and Atonement1 move Jesus' Divinity and Sonship2 moves Monotheism and worship1 move Trinity in the Old Testament1 move Biblical canon / textual authority2 moves Encouragement / patience1 move Prophets and language of revelation1 move Jesus' Crucifixion1 move Islamic Theology4 moves Divine names / fatherhood2 moves Rest in Christ1 move Original sin / Eden narrative1 move

13:3213:3214:4514:4515:4816:5218:3918:3923:1123:1128:0028:0041:4141:5542:1742:1746:0546:0554:181:01:471:21:481:26:271:33:571:33:571:44:341:44:341:49:171:49:171:53:212:00:492:04:302:04:302:17:202:22:042:34:492:34:492:43:412:43:412:46:082:46:08

Quran 5:46 presents the Injil as a revelation given to Jesus that confirms the Torah, complicating claims that the Gospel was lost or disconnected from earlier scripture.1 moveChristian13:32 The Gospel of Barnabas is treated as a late forged text rather than a reliable alternative to the received gospel tradition.1 moveChristian14:45 The apostolic Gospel presents Jesus as the Son of God whose mission includes dying for sins, giving his life as a ransom, and rising again, in conflict with Quranic denials of his sonship.1 moveChristian15:48-16:52 Jesus is uniquely the eternal Word and begotten Son of God, not a created son in the way Adam is.1 moveChristian18:39 Jesus' family's flight to Egypt raises a question about divine protection if Jesus is God's Son.1 moveMuslim2:34:49 Jesus teaches that the Son should receive the same honor given to the Father.1 moveChristian23:11 Isaiah's prophecy gives divine titles to the coming son and ruler, so sonship language is not merely a late pagan or Greco-Roman interpolation.1 moveChristian28:00 Matthew and Acts can be read as complementary accounts of Judas's death rather than as a contradiction.1 moveChristian41:41-41:55 The Ahaziah age difference can be treated as a manuscript copying variant rather than a substantive Bible contradiction.1 moveChristian42:17 Christian responses to mockery and persecution should emphasize joyful endurance rather than violent retaliation.1 moveChristian46:05 Quranic passages include commanded or reported speech, complicating the claim that every Quranic word is Allah speaking directly in one voice.1 moveChristian54:18-1:01:47 The Quran conflicts with biblical teaching by denying Jesus' crucifixion, suffering, and resurrection.1 moveChristian1:21:48-1:26:27 If true belief in Islam requires full submission to Muhammad's judgment, calling Jesus a Muslim is problematic.1 moveChristian1:33:57 Jesus' prostration to the Father can be cited as evidence that he submitted to God.1 moveMuslim2:04:30 Biblical passages depicting Jesus addressing God and praying are used to argue that Jesus submitted to God.1 moveMuslim2:17:20-2:22:04 A hadith saying Allah would replace sinless people with sinners creates a difficulty for Islamic accounts of sin and forgiveness.1 moveChristian2:43:41 The Islamic conception of Allah, which rejects fatherhood and sonship, is not equivalent to the Christian God addressed as Father.1 moveChristian1:44:34 Biblical Father/Son language for Jesus conflicts with Quranic language that creatures come to Allah only as slaves.1 moveChristian1:53:21-2:00:49 Christ offers rest to those who come to him.1 moveChristian1:49:17 Genesis 3 frames Adam and Eve's eating of the fruit as producing awareness of nakedness after disobedience.1 moveMuslim2:46:08

Moves and responses

Claim-grouped references

Topic

Response 113:32 onward1 reference

Torah and Gospel Corruption

Argument claim

1 move1 reference13:32

Quran 5:46 presents the Injil as a revelation given to Jesus that confirms the Torah, complicating claims that the Gospel was lost or disconnected from earlier scripture.

Replies that the Quran itself describes the Injil as given to Jesus and confirming the Torah.
1
ChristianQuranReplyPrimary Evidence
Quran 5:46 · 00:13:32

Topic

Response 214:45 onward1 reference

Gospel Reliability

Argument claim

1 move1 reference14:45

The Gospel of Barnabas is treated as a late forged text rather than a reliable alternative to the received gospel tradition.

Responds to a question about the Gospel of Barnabas by identifying it as a later forgery.
1
ChristianGospelReplyContext
Gospel of Barnabas · 00:14:45
Muslim broth up this `Gospel of Barnabas` and Christian responses

Topic

Response 315:48-16:524 references

Jesus' Mission and Atonement

Argument claim

1 move4 references15:48-16:52

The apostolic Gospel presents Jesus as the Son of God whose mission includes dying for sins, giving his life as a ransom, and rising again, in conflict with Quranic denials of his sonship.

Argues that the received apostolic Gospel teaches Jesus' saving death, ransom, resurrection, and sonship, while the Quran rejects calling Jesus Allah's son.
1
ChristianBibleObjectionPrimary Evidence
1 Corinthians 15:3-4 · 00:15:48
2
ChristianBibleObjectionPrimary Evidence
Mark 10:45 · 00:16:35
3
ChristianBibleObjectionPrimary Evidence
Matthew 20:28 · 00:16:35
4
ChristianQuranObjectionCounter Evidence
Quran 9:30 · 00:16:52

Topic

Response 418:39 onward2 references

Jesus' Divinity and Sonship

Argument claim

1 move2 references18:39

Jesus is uniquely the eternal Word and begotten Son of God, not a created son in the way Adam is.

Replies that Jesus is God's eternal Word and uniquely begotten Son, unlike Adam or other created sons.
1
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
John 1:1 · 00:18:39
2
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
John 1:18 · 00:18:39

Topic

Response 523:11 onward1 reference

Monotheism and worship

Argument claim

1 move1 reference23:11

Jesus teaches that the Son should receive the same honor given to the Father.

Responds to the worship objection by citing Jesus' teaching that the Son is to be honored as the Father is honored.
1
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
John 5:23 · 00:23:11

Topic

Response 628:00 onward1 reference

Trinity in the Old Testament

Argument claim

1 move1 reference28:00

Isaiah's prophecy gives divine titles to the coming son and ruler, so sonship language is not merely a late pagan or Greco-Roman interpolation.

Challenges the claim that sonship language was a later alteration by appealing to Isaiah's wording about the son and Mighty God.
1
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
Isaiah 9:6-7 · 00:28:00

Topic

Responses 7-841:41-42:174 references

Biblical canon / textual authority

Argument claim

1 move2 references41:41-41:55

Matthew and Acts can be read as complementary accounts of Judas's death rather than as a contradiction.

Replies to a Bible contradiction objection by combining Matthew's hanging account with Acts' fall account.
1
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
Matthew 27:5 · 00:41:41
2
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
Acts 1:18 · 00:41:55

Argument claim

1 move2 references42:17

The Ahaziah age difference can be treated as a manuscript copying variant rather than a substantive Bible contradiction.

Answers the Ahaziah age objection by appealing to manuscript evidence and copyist error.
1
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
2 Chronicles 22:2 · 00:42:17
2
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
2 Kings 8:26 · 00:42:17

Topic

Response 946:05 onward1 reference

Encouragement / patience

Argument claim

1 move1 reference46:05

Christian responses to mockery and persecution should emphasize joyful endurance rather than violent retaliation.

Replies to concerns about mockery of Christianity by saying believers should endure persecution without chasing every insult.
1
ChristianBibleReplyPrimary Evidence
Matthew 5:11-12 · 00:46:05

Topic

Response 1054:18-1:01:474 references

Prophets and language of revelation

Argument claim

1 move4 references54:18-1:01:47

Quranic passages include commanded or reported speech, complicating the claim that every Quranic word is Allah speaking directly in one voice.

Challenges the claim that the Quran is entirely Allah's direct speech by citing commands to speak, quoted jinn, and speaker ambiguity in Surah 11.
1
ChristianQuranObjectionPrimary Evidence
Quran 5:68 · 00:54:18
2
ChristianQuranObjectionSupporting Evidence
Quran 72 · 00:55:32
3
ChristianQuranObjectionContext
Quran 11:1 · 00:57:17
4
ChristianQuranObjectionPrimary Evidence
Quran 11:2 · 01:01:47

Topic

Response 111:21:48-1:26:276 references

Jesus' Crucifixion

Argument claim

1 move6 references1:21:48-1:26:27

The Quran conflicts with biblical teaching by denying Jesus' crucifixion, suffering, and resurrection.

Argues that biblical texts teach the Messiah's crucifixion and resurrection, while Quran 4:157 denies that he was killed or crucified.
1
ChristianBibleObjectionPrimary Evidence
1 Corinthians 15:3-4 · 01:21:48
2
ChristianQuranObjectionCounter Evidence
Quran 4:157 · 01:21:48
3
ChristianBibleObjectionSupporting Evidence
Psalm 22:12-16 · 01:22:03
4
ChristianBibleObjectionSupporting Evidence
Isaiah 53:5-6 · 01:22:28
5
ChristianBibleObjectionPrimary Evidence
Luke 24:46 · 01:22:52
6
ChristianQuranObjectionPrimary Evidence
Quran 4:157 · 01:26:27

Topic

Response 121:33:57 onward1 reference

Islamic Theology

Argument claim

1 move1 reference1:33:57

If true belief in Islam requires full submission to Muhammad's judgment, calling Jesus a Muslim is problematic.

Challenges the claim that Jesus was Muslim by citing a Quranic requirement to submit to Muhammad's judgment.
1
ChristianQuranObjectionPrimary Evidence
Quran 4:65 · 01:33:57

Topic

Response 131:44:34 onward1 reference

Divine names / fatherhood

Argument claim

1 move1 reference1:44:34

The Islamic conception of Allah, which rejects fatherhood and sonship, is not equivalent to the Christian God addressed as Father.

Argues that rejecting divine fatherhood and sonship separates the Islamic conception of Allah from the Christian God called Father.
1
ChristianQuranObjectionPrimary Evidence
Quran 19:88-91 · 01:44:34

Topic

Response 141:49:17 onward1 reference

Rest in Christ

Argument claim

1 move1 reference1:49:17

Christ offers rest to those who come to him.

Urges strained Muslim listeners to come to Christ for rest.
1
ChristianBibleStatementPrimary Evidence
Matthew 11:28 · 01:49:17

Topic

Response 151:53:21-2:00:493 references

Divine names / fatherhood

Argument claim

1 move3 references1:53:21-2:00:49

Biblical Father/Son language for Jesus conflicts with Quranic language that creatures come to Allah only as slaves.

Uses Jesus addressing the Father and identifying as Son of God against the Quranic claim that all come to Allah only as slaves.
1
ChristianBibleObjectionPrimary Evidence
Luke 23:34 · 01:53:21
2
ChristianQuranObjectionCounter Evidence
Quran 19:93 · 01:56:46
3
ChristianBibleObjectionPrimary Evidence
John 10:36 · 02:00:49

Topic

Responses 16-172:04:30-2:22:043 references

Islamic Theology

Argument claim

1 move1 reference2:04:30

Jesus' prostration to the Father can be cited as evidence that he submitted to God.

Cites Jesus praying with his face to the ground as a biblical detail supporting his submission to God.
1
MuslimBibleEvidencePrimary Evidence
Matthew 26:39 · 02:04:30

Argument claim

1 move2 references2:17:20-2:22:04

Biblical passages depicting Jesus addressing God and praying are used to argue that Jesus submitted to God.

Appeals to Jesus saying 'my God and your God' and praying on the ground as evidence of submission.
1
MuslimBibleEvidencePrimary Evidence
John 20:17 · 02:17:20
2
MuslimBibleEvidenceSupporting Evidence
Matthew 26:39 · 02:22:04

Topic

Response 182:34:49 onward1 reference

Jesus' Divinity and Sonship

Argument claim

1 move1 reference2:34:49

Jesus' family's flight to Egypt raises a question about divine protection if Jesus is God's Son.

Asks why Jesus' family needed to flee to Egypt if Jesus was God's Son.
1
MuslimBibleQuestionPrimary Evidence
Matthew 2:13-14 · 02:34:49

Topic

Response 192:43:41 onward1 reference

Islamic Theology

Argument claim

1 move1 reference2:43:41

A hadith saying Allah would replace sinless people with sinners creates a difficulty for Islamic accounts of sin and forgiveness.

Replies to the sin-and-free-will discussion by citing a hadith about Allah replacing sinless people with sinners who seek forgiveness.
1
ChristianHadithReplyPrimary Evidence
Sahih Muslim 2748b · 02:43:41

Topic

Response 202:46:08 onward1 reference

Original sin / Eden narrative

Argument claim

1 move1 reference2:46:08

Genesis 3 frames Adam and Eve's eating of the fruit as producing awareness of nakedness after disobedience.

Brings Genesis 3 into the exchange over whether sin produces awareness of God or separation from God.
1
MuslimBibleInterpretationPrimary Evidence
Genesis 3:6-7 · 02:46:08

Most cited passages

1 Corinthians 15:3-42 citations
Matthew 26:392 citations
Quran 4:1572 citations
2 Chronicles 22:21 citation
2 Kings 8:261 citation

Most active responses

Islamic Theology4 moves
Biblical canon / textual authority2 moves
Divine names / fatherhood2 moves
Jesus' Divinity and Sonship2 moves
Encouragement / patience1 move

Claim lanes

Claims mapped inside this debate.

A hadith saying Allah would replace sinless people with sinners creates a difficulty for Islamic accounts of sin and forgiveness.1 move
Biblical Father/Son language for Jesus conflicts with Quranic language that creatures come to Allah only as slaves.1 move
Biblical passages depicting Jesus addressing God and praying are used to argue that Jesus submitted to God.1 move
Christ offers rest to those who come to him.1 move
Christian responses to mockery and persecution should emphasize joyful endurance rather than violent retaliation.1 move

Side lanes

Move share by side in this debate.

Christian

16 moves

Muslim

4 moves

Source stream

Dec 16, 2024

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